That makes two of us (stumbling in the dark, I mean). You are in the correct place (at least by my logic). The thing that we want to replace is the "Elevation Map" TypeID=0xA9DD6FF4 GroupID=0xE98F9525 InstanceID=0x00000001

How are you getting the Extract menu item? I was using the context menu (right-click on the Elevation Map), but I notice that there is also an Extract item in the main File Menu.

I get two output files: the data file, with the name that I specify, and the associated .TGI file, which contains the above TypeID, GroupID, and InstanceID. I have verified that the hex data contained in the data file matches the hex data for the Elevation Map, displayed by the Raw Data (Hex) view in DatGen; i.e., the extract worked correctly.

I have also verified that this extracted data is identical to the data file generated using DZUtils extract.

I asked about importing the terrain on the simtropolis forum. With any luck, someone there will be able to help us. No replies so far, unfortunately:
http://www.simtropolis.com/forum/me...6&enterthread=y

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I had another thought last night which I am going to try today. Since I can get "Remove File" to work in DatGen, but not "Import File", I thought that I might try to remove the old terrain using DatGen and append the new terrain using DZUtils.

[Update:] It works! If you can provide me with a new empty base-game compatible SC4 file, I'll get this terrain imported for you. Then, let me see whether I can get the roads transferred over (less likely). If not, I don't think that it would be too much trouble for you to add the roads yourself using SimCity 4.

In fact, it would be very helpful for me if you could create three empty SC4 files, one for each sized city. It would be better for me to have base-game compatible templates for my work with HoodReplace.

I now have a vision of being able to extract the SC4 file from a TS2 neighborhood, and possibly even being able to extract a terrain picture from an SC4 file for later import.

How to extract the terrain from a SimCity 4 Rush Hour .SC4 file and import it into a SimCity 4 base-game .SC4 file:

Requirements:
You will need two utilities:

1) DZUtils:
http://www.moreawesomethanyou.com/s...pic,6992.0.html

2) DatGen:
http://www.simtropolis.com/modding/...details&id=334#

As well, I recommend that you create a temporary working directory on your hard drive and do everything in that directory, rather than using your original files. You should be sure to keep your original files in a safe place until you are completely satisfied with the results of this tutorial.

Instructions:

1) Run your SimCity 4 game and create a completely empty city (no roads, no bridges, no trees, no deco). This city will eventually have the terrain that you want. Copy this new empty city to your working directory. Be sure to create a city which is the same size as your original city.

2) Copy the original SimCity 4 Rush Hour city which has your desired terrain into the working directory.

3) Copy the DZUtils append.exe and extract.exe to your working directory.

4) Use either DatGen or DZUtils (extract.exe) to extract the Elevation Map from the original city in your working directory:
TypeID = 0xA9DD6FF4
GroupID = 0x398F9525
Instance = 0x00000001

I just used the following command:
extract -g E98F9525 -t A9DD6FF4 -i 1 -s 0 "City - Incy Isle.sc4"

Note that DZUtils must be run from a command prompt.

5) If necessary, move the extracted data file to your working directory and rename the file to: E98F9525-A9DD6FF4-00000001-00000000.dat

6) Use DatGen to remove the Elevation Map (Terrain Instance 1) from the empty city in your working directory

7) Use DZUtils (append.exe) to append the extracted Elevation Map (from steps 4 and 5) to the empty city in your working directory. I used the following command, where my empty city name was "City - New Terrain.sc4":
append "City - New Terrain.sc4" E98F9525-A9DD6FF4-00000001-00000000.dat

8) Copy your new city to your SimCity 4 Downloads folder, import it into SimCity 4 and start editing.

Note: the view of your new city in the region has not been updated by this tutorial. You need to edit the city to see the new terrain. When you save, the view should be updated.

I right-clicked on the Elevation Map, I believe.



Great! You do know only the smallest SC4 map size transfers to Sims2?
I'll happily make them for you. Should be posted later today.

I assume once you transfer the files, I can make any desired terrain/road changes myself with SC4 and HoodReplace?
Thanks for working this out, it was certainly beyond me.

Only if you rely on EA. If you are using HoodReplace, you can use any size of SimCity (Disclaimer: at this time, HoodReplace can't copy roads directly from an SC4 file). As well, Sims Castaway Stories have neighborhoods which are twice the height and width of the Sims 2 neighborhoods.

That's what I'm hoping. However, I need to have a base-game compatible SC4 file before we can test this on your machine. (Since I have Deluxe, I can't be sure that the resulting file is still base-game compatible.)

Okay, here is a set of three terrain sizes from base SC4. I'll check back later to see if you have made magic happen...

Here it is. Please let me know what happens.

Notes:

1) The city impostor in the region view has not been updated. Ignore it. Just edit the city and the impostor will be updated when you save.

2) There is an odd disconnect with the water level when you enter the city. Just ignore it. Save your city and the game should fix it. Then, you can edit your city to add roads and make the other changes that you want.

Please let me know if either of these issues is not fixed when you save the city. Especially #2. If the game can't resolve the problem, I may need you to create an empty city with a specific terrain elevation.

Nope, the water level didn't fix itself. I added a strip of road to make sure it had somethign to save, exited to region and re-entered. It still looks like your screenshot with floating water.

I did get a loadable city though. Should I try it in Sims2?

I installed the file despite the odd water level. It looks mostly okay in-game.

In comparison with the original map, the height of the terrain looks the same to me. I can't see anything wrong with the water level. The only glitch I could see was that there are trees under the ocean. Not sure if I can get rid of them.

I didn't try loading a lot or making any sims to test.

Is there an easy way to know what height the terrain is?

Funny. The first time that I tried importing this SC4 file and editing it using SimCity 4 Deluxe, the water level fixed itself. I tried again, importing and editing the same city file, and the water level still had the disconnect. I can't think of anything obvious that I did differently between the two tests.

My initial tests with this technique were done with the Pleasantview.SC4 which shipped with TS2. I'm not sure whether that's a SimCity4-base-game-compatible SC4 file or not, but it did not have this problem. This is why I speculated that an SC4 file with the "correct" terrain and water levels for TS2 would resolve this issue.

Are you able to edit Pleasantview.SC4 with your copy of SimCity 4?

The trees should be removed from the empty SC4 file *before* we use the technique, since the trees are not modified when the terrain elevation array is replaced. Alternatively, I could look into removing the entire tree record from the SC4 file... I'd want to make sure that the record will regenerate if trees are subsequently added in SimCity 4.

I'll have to look up the correct terrain level for TS2. Perhaps it would make more sense for me to install my SimCity 4 base-game onto one of my other machines, so that I can fool around with creating the perfect empty SC4 to TS2 terrain. I'm sure glad that I picked up that extra SimCity 4 game when I saw it in the bargain bin.

Besides which, I want to change the city names... I'd feel really silly if HoodReplace created SC4 files with my name in them.

So, all of that aside for a moment.

Are we on the right track? Excluding the water disconnect and the extraneous trees, which are likely fixable, are you happy with the results? Does this give you a terrain that you can work with? Is the lack of roads a major problem? Is this better than just starting from scratch?

SimCity 4 has the ability to generate the regional terrain from a picture. Personally, I find the in-game terrain editing so odious that I prefer to use this technique for my terrains. Would you find it more useful to have me generate a picture from your original SC4, rather than copying the terrain to a new SC4 file?

Don't know, don't seem to have one. I'll have to figure out how to get it back, then I'll try for you.

This process certainly gives me a terrain I can modify. I can add my own roads without much stress. As you say, it is the terrrain editing which is hard to get just right, and more so when copying what has already been laid out. This is better than starting from scratch when I already have a map, but just want it a bit different.

It's possible I added trees to the smallest map while trying to figure out how to get it named. I can make a new set, and leave your name off in the process.

Of course, I am kicking myself all through this - when I decided to start again, I should have just taken the time to make a map myself. I thought this hood might not last long, so I just bunged in something I had that was okay. Reap as you sow!

You mean you get a picture of what you want, and the game just generates it for you? Wow. But I don't understand how the result would be different than what you have done so far. Explain some more please?

The whole process at the moment is one-way only.

You can start with a picture (where the different elevations are depicted by different levels of grey), and then use that picture to make one or more SC4 files, but you can't get the picture back out of the SC4 file to allow you to do more terrain editing using a picture editing program. From that point on, you have to use the SimCity 4 terrain editing tools.

Some people find it easier to edit a picture than to use the SimCity 4 terrain editing tools.

As well, using a picture makes it very easy to share terrains, since they are much smaller than the corresponding SimCity 4 region.

It's also much easier to do an entire SimCity 4 region from a picture, than to terrain edit all of the cities which make up the region.

Finally, there are a number of sites where you can get terrain maps of different places in the world. This allows people to make realistic SimCity 4 regions which reflect real places.

I'm attaching an example where I downloaded an image of a real lake from google maps, fiddled with it using image processing tools, then created a SimCity 4 region from the resulting picture.

If you've never used a picture to generate an SC4 terrain, and you're used to the SimCity 4 terrain editing, then you probably don't need me to extract the picture.

In the same way, you can use an SC4 file to generate a neighborhood terrain for TS2, but you can't extract the SC4 file back out of the TS2 neighborhood package to allow you to do further terrain editing using SimCity 4. Until Pescado and I (independently) found a way to replace the hood terrain, people were stuck with their original terrains.

Even with HoodReplace, if someone loses their SC4 file, they can't use SimCity 4 to edit their terrain anymore. Plus, if your SC4 file was created using Rush Hour and you only have the base-game SimCity 4, you couldn't edit your terrain.

My thought is to allow people to move backwards through this entire process: TS2 -> SC4 -> Pictures.

Anyway, let me try making the same changes to the Pleasantview.SC4 file and you can see whether it's base-game compatible. [Update: doesn't work because it still has the Pleaseantview roads; I need to find out where the roads are stored so that I can remove them.]

So, I'll install the SimCity 4 base-game and try to generate a flat empty terrain which won't have the water level disconnect problem. I'll have to do some research into the correct terrain elevations for TS2, so this will take a while.

I can't seem to retrieve my missing Pleasantview (or Veronaville, come to that). They appear to be completely gone.

Usually if I'm deleting Eaxis things I keep them somewhere, but I can't find those maps. Regenerating the Sims 2 folder didn't work. In-game, all the Maxis hoods appear again, but not Pleasantview or Veronaville. In the SC4Terrains folder, I only get the concrete.png and dirt.png, and no more of the required files. Weird.

Are they on the disk somewhere? I can replace Pleasantview with the 'fixed' one from the Hoodreplace thread, but that's not the same really. Or I could re-install the whole game, I suppose, but I'm not that keen!

Thanks for the explanation, I can see where that technique would be useful. I haven't needed it so far myself. One day I might, and then I'll at least have an inkling that it is possible.

So if you're installing base SC4 for yourself, there's no point me giving you more empty terrains, is there?

I think that means I'm just waiting for you to finish researching then. So, I'd better go do some of my actual work.

That's right. Don't worry about Pleasantview, it was just a thought that didn't pan out. If you ever need those files, I can upload the whole set for you.

I'll work on getting this technique cleaned up and working better. It just seems simpler for me to try to make the empty SC4 files myself, since it may take a number of attempts to get it right.

I also want to see whether I can remove the trees and roads, or (even better) replace the trees and roads with the set that matches the new terrain.

Glad you've found a new interest! Let me know if/when I can assist.

If you would upload or send me the Veronaville and Pleasantview map files, that would be great. I'll put them somewhere safe this time. Don't know why they have vanished so completely.

Have fun with the maps then, I'll check back every now and then to see if there's an update. Thanks for your help.

This is part of the work that I've had on my list for HoodReplace. You just increased its priority. I thought that I might be able to get you a workable solution in a fairly short time; almost did, too!

Unfortunately, plasticbox is having a major problem with a new full neighborhood update, so the priority on this has been bumped down a bit. However, I don't think that there's too much more that I need to do to get this working for you.

The only thing left (we hope) is to determine the "correct" elevation for an initial TS2 neighborhood. I thought that I'd seen that information somewhere, but I can't seem to find it at the moment.

The other alternative is to remove the entire roads array and ensure that it will regenerate. In the long run, I'll need both pieces, but either piece alone should solve the problem with the disconnected water level.

Less than a day's work in total, I imagine.

Techie stuff:

Thought that it would be a good idea to document this somewhere.

Elevation Map:
TypeID = A9DD6FF4
GroupID = E98F9525
Instance = 1

Note that the water level for TS2 = 312.5, but the water level for SC4 is around 250. Water level for imported pictures is 83.

Tree Placement:
TypeID = A9C05C85
GroupID = 299B2D1B
Instance = 0

Tree Placement record can be removed and all trees will disappear. When trees are added in-game, record is regenerated, so it should be safe to delete.

Transport Network:
TypeID = C9C05C65
GroupID = 299B2D1B
Instance = 0

Transport Network record can be removed and all roads will disappear, but not bridges. When roads are added in-game, record is regenerated, so it should be safe to delete.

I notice that the GroupID is identical for some of these records. Might want to check out other records in this group. Also of interest (?):

Terrain Arrays:
TypeID =2990C1BC
GroupID = 299B2D1B
Instance = 0

Note that DatGen has a bug. If you sort the list of records by TypeID, to find a specific record more easily, and then select and remove a record, the wrong record will be removed. Therefore, if you want to remove a record, be sure not to re-sort the list of records.

aelflaed, would you try something quick for me?

- Run SimCity 4 and enter the city that I sent you, which you imported.
- Hold down the <shift> <ctrl> and <alt> keys then click on "God Mode" (the first button at the left, with the sun, beside "Mayor Mode")
- Click on "Terrain Effects" (the second button down, with the blowing cloud)
- Click once on "Lower Terrain Level" (button at bottom, arrow pointing down to a line)
- Click once on "Raise Terrain Level" (next button up, arrow pointing up to a line)

Does that fix the disconnect? Are the trees all gone? Are there any remaining problems with this terrain?

If you believe that an unoccupied neighborhood may have become corrupted, here's a simple way to create a new neighborhood and copy over some or all of the lots.

This technique may also allow you to safely remove all sims from an occupied TS2 neighborhood, as long as you don't have any occupied apartment buildings. If you do have occupied apartments, be sure to move all of your sim families out of the apartments before attempting this technique.

1) Move your old neighborhood out of your "The Sims 2" directory; I'll call this neighborhood V1. Put it in a safe place, we'll need it later.
2) Create your new neighborhood; I'll call it V2

If the neighborhood number matters, do the following:
3) Rename the neighborhood directory to the correct neighborhood number
4) Rename all files and directories within the new neighborhood to have the correct neighborhood number prefix
5) Use SimPE to edit the ID for V2 (* see below for an alternative method)
- UID:
- (parent) Name:

If you haven't got the correct terrain, roads, deco, etc. in your new neighborhood:
6) Use HoodReplace to copy terrain and structures from V1 to V2

Now that your neighborhood is set up correctly, let's copy those lots:
7) Use SimPE to extract all Lot Descriptions (LTXT) from V1
8) Use SimPE to add all Lot Descriptions into V2
9) Note down lot numbers for any lots which you no longer want
10) Delete LTXT for any lots that you don't want

11) Copy all lot packages from V1 to V2, except for the lot numbers that you noted in step 9 above.
12) Copy neighborhood PNG from V1 to V2

* Alternatively, you might want to do this:
- Use SimPE to extract ID from V1
- Use SimPE to replace ID for V2 with ID from V1

Hey, it works! I haven't loaded it into TS2 yet, but the water disconnect vanished instantly. I can't see any trees on the terrain in SC4, I'll check in Sims2 as well though.

How did you figure that out? That's just so easy it's stunning.

I've been playing the terrain I installed with disconnect a few days ago. Haven't seen any glitches in TS2, plays normally with Res lots, Comm lots and sims. The water was fine as well, the disconnect was only apparent in SC4.

And now that's okay too. Thanks.

I just had a random thought, tried it, and it worked. I remembered playing around with that feature before and realized that it might be a quick fix.

I'd like to understand why this water level disconnect is happening and try to fix it using DatGen or SimPE (and eventually HoodReplace), but I was also interested in getting you a solution as quickly as possible.

Thanks for spurring me on, to move a couple of steps closer to my goal of extracting an SC4 file from a TS2 neighborhood.

I wanted to put this picture out to see whether it's useful to people.

Mootilda, I altered that terrain map, added roads and installed it. It seems fine in-game, no random trees or anything.

Somehow all the roadwork ended up backwards - and yes, I know it is supposed to, but I thought I had allowed for that specially. However, uinless something odd happened as a result of your modifications, I presume I just got it mixed up.

I like that diagram. I think it would be useful.

Thanks for bringing this to my attention. I'd forgotten that SimCity 4 and TS2 terrains are reversed. That shouldn't affect this case, since we're copying from SC4 to SC4, but I should definitely keep this in mind when doing TS2 -> SC4 and SC4 -> TS2.

Now why do you suppose that EA did such a bizarre thing with reversing the terrain?

I'm glad that the terrain is working for you. I didn't do anything special to the road array, so I imagine that you just got turned around. It's easy to do.

I suppose that I ought to write this up as a proper tutorial, although it might be worth waiting until I see whether I can get the roads copied over as well. I hold out less hope for this, since the primary purpose of Rush Hour was to add new types of roads. This implies that the array would change and so we can't copy it directly, the way that we did with the terrain.

Well, those particular roads weren't difficult to rebuild, but a larger hood might be tricky.

I can't get the beachfront right yet, but I suppose it just needs fiddling.

I also want to make flatter beach minilots. Mutantbunny's are okay, but rather lumpy. However, when I tried to do it a month or two ago, they kept crashing. Might have to wade through old posts and see if I can work out what has to be done - they shrank fine with the recent Lotadjuster, but were hard to place and tended to crash.

Crashes aren't good. Are you aware that plasticbox has been having a crash associated with the LA? Perhaps I should take a look at your lot as well. Why don't you post your lot in a new thread in the private forum? Or, ask plasticbox to add you to the crashing lots testing group. [Update: looks like you should have received an invitation.]

Yes, I have. Now I have to see if I can find those lots and remember which ones crashed...